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the luck needed

Posted By: Keene
Date: Tuesday, 17 March 2009, at 4:27 p.m.

In Response To: the luck needed (garyo)

In your example (5NT vs 6D), the best contract is going to be the slam, and it should be bid that way - I mean, how many people end up in 5NT. If you are bidding for a grand, then I can see a 5NT pull out, but bidding for the grand you are much more likely to end up small.

I suppose that a lot depends on the bidding system used, and whether that allows for a 4-5 minor fit or not, to try for the slam. I am not experienced enough with SAYC, but I do know that the modified ACOL I used did allow for it (and indeed a 4-4 and 4-3 minor fit - not that these are common at small slams). In this case, if your bidding system isnt allowing you to find the fit, then your system is at fault, and the players that utilize a system that allows you to find it will win out almost all the time.

Example:

North 5-4-4-0 (S-H-D-C), 15pts (+void) total South 3-3-5-2 (S-H-D-C), 11pts total

North will invariably bid spades initially, checking for hearts during bidding, and South will settle on a 4 or 5 spades contract with insufficient support for slam - thats the SAYC style, whereas the ACOL style is to bid the 5 card suit responsively, not just automatically agree because of the 3 card support. North will then easily find the diamond slam which should be there. I imagine that a sequence of:

SAYC: 1S - 3S - 4H - 4S - 5S - pass (or some ace asking form prior to 5S being achieved) ACOL: 1S - 2D - 3H - 3S - 4D - 5C (neg) - 6D (or some ace asking for the holes, prior to slam bid)

Would probably be normal - although as I said, I am not familiar enough with SAYC to say for certain, I am sure you could confirm.

I realize that I am just nitpicking your example, but a stronger pair is not defined by what their bidding system allows, it is defined by how often a best defense or best offense is found. Your system should never fail you, and if it does, it should be fixed so that it doesnt fail you the same way again. My argument here is: Were you unlucky that your system didnt allow you to find the diamond slam? I think not. Doesnt matter who your opponents are. Were they lucky you didnt find it? Or just pleased that you couldnt find it?

Its been a while since I played. My interest is once again stoked.

Messages In This Thread

• other than Kit ---
  garyo -- Thursday, 12 March 2009, at 4:13 a.m.
  • other than Kit ---
    neilkaz -- Thursday, 12 March 2009, at 4:46 a.m.
    • other than Kit ---
      garyo -- Thursday, 12 March 2009, at 6:15 p.m.
      • other than Kit ---
        Keene -- Friday, 13 March 2009, at 4:08 p.m.
        • the luck needed
          garyo -- Sunday, 15 March 2009, at 5:50 a.m.
          • the luck needed
            Keene -- Monday, 16 March 2009, at 5:37 p.m.
            • the luck needed
              garyo -- Tuesday, 17 March 2009, at 5:18 a.m.
              • the luck needed
                Keene -- Tuesday, 17 March 2009, at 4:27 p.m.
                • the luck needed
                  garyo -- Wednesday, 18 March 2009, at 4:01 p.m.
  • other than Kit ---
    Stick -- Thursday, 12 March 2009, at 11:45 a.m.
    • other than Kit ---
      Barry Silliman -- Thursday, 12 March 2009, at 12:45 p.m.
      • other than Kit ---
        Stick -- Thursday, 12 March 2009, at 12:50 p.m.