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BGonline.org Forums
Rollout 26% take point
Posted By: Bob Koca In Response To: Rollout 26% take point (Stanley E. Richards)
Date: Thursday, 23 December 2010, at 9:47 p.m.
"My tables assume a take point which is 60% towards the Dead TP. 30% - (30%-23%) x .6 = 26%."
That works for for a longish race for money play (78% is 60% of the way from 75% to 80%) but how much did you test it for various match play scores? In particular I think you will be dropping too easily if your recube has a low give point. For example if 3a doubles 4a the dead and live values are 35.17% and 21.07%. Your guideline gives an effective takepoint of 26.71% which is off by a lot. It seems to be only about 24.3 or 24.4% which is needed.
is Player 2
score: 0
pip: 934 point match pip: 84
score: 1
is Player 1
XGID=---BCBCCAA-----aabbccba---:0:0:1:00:1:0:0:4:10 on roll, cube action?
Analyzed in Rollout No Double Player Winning Chances: 75.74% (G: 0.00% B: 0.00%) Opponent Winning Chances: 24.26% (G: 0.00% B: 0.00%) Double/Take Player Winning Chances: 75.68% (G: 0.00% B: 0.00%) Opponent Winning Chances: 24.32% (G: 0.00% B: 0.00%) Cubeless Equities No Double: +0.515 Double: +1.532 Cubeful Equities No Double: +0.835 (-0.165) Double/Take: +1.005 (+0.005) Double/Drop: +1.000 Best Cube action: Double / Drop Rollout details 1296 Games rolled with Variance Reduction.
Dice Seed: 4
Moves and cube decisions: 3 plyConfidence No Double: ± 0.003 (+0.832...+0.838) Confidence Double: ± 0.005 (+1.000...+1.009) Double Decision confidence: 100.0% Take Decision confidence: 96.7% Duration: 1 minute 34 seconds eXtreme Gammon Version: 1.21, MET: Rockwell-Kazaross
Also realize that it should be tailored to the individual position. For example as races become shorter there is less cube power. A holding game with a prime ready also has less cube power.
"The below rollout shows a GWC of 24.5% and a small drop (.039)."
No and No. Get the GWC from the DT and not the no double. 1.05 take equity means taking is a .050 error.
"However, XG 3 ply believed that the GWC was 26.22% and this would be a take. The take point seems to be 26% for this problem"
The 26.22% gives a very solid take and you only decrement it by .22% to get what you think is the minimum %age needed. If there are no gammons every extra 1% of loss chances adjusts the take equity by about .04. The 3 ply gave a take by about .078 so adjust down to about 24.3% and not to just 26%. Also you would rather look at a rollout here. The 3 ply is just sort of guessing how much the recube power will be. I made the position a little better to get a borderline choice and it suggest the takepoint for this type of position is very close to 25%.
is Player 2
score: 0
pip: 313 point match pip: 57
score: 0
is Player 1
XGID=aBBBCCC---------------b---:0:0:-1:00:0:0:0:3:10 on roll, cube action?
Analyzed in Rollout No Double Player Winning Chances: 74.88% (G: 0.00% B: 0.00%) Opponent Winning Chances: 25.12% (G: 0.00% B: 0.00%) Double/Take Player Winning Chances: 74.98% (G: 0.00% B: 0.00%) Opponent Winning Chances: 25.02% (G: 0.00% B: 0.00%) Cubeless Equities No Double: +0.498 Double: +1.268 Cubeful Equities No Double: +0.925 (-0.075) Double/Take: +1.001 (+0.001) Double/Drop: +1.000 Best Cube action: Double / Drop Rollout details 1296 Games rolled with Variance Reduction.
Dice Seed: 4
Moves and cube decisions: 3 plyConfidence No Double: ± 0.020 (+0.905...+0.944) Confidence Double: ± 0.026 (+0.975...+1.027) Double Decision confidence: 100.0% Take Decision confidence: 52.1% Duration: 27.1 seconds eXtreme Gammon Version: 1.21, MET: Rockwell-Kazaross
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