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BGonline.org Forums
Enforcing Little Rules, Pittsburgh Edition
Posted By: Henrik Bukkjaer In Response To: Enforcing Little Rules, Pittsburgh Edition (Chiva Tafazzoli)
Date: Tuesday, 22 February 2011, at 12:14 a.m.
Expecting some real penalty is fine. Enforcing those penalties is a mess.
Who picked up the dice? Was it premature? Do both admit the fact? Are there witnesses? Discussions without an end... Readjusting the clock... etc.... (just one scneario from many possible ones).
Is it worth to interrupt the concentration of both players and the flow of an ongoing match, create bad blood and bitterness just because someone didnīt shake the cup on his opening roll? I doubt it. I much prefer to see both players acting as gentlemen and respecting the rules with maybe a reminder when necessary....
I think it's too naive to simply state "we don't need rules, we should just all get along"...
Even though I agree with you that this should simply not be necessary, if both players always behave as gents, but the problem here is, they don't!
And Jason is not talking about interrupting "both players concentration" - he's talking of the scenario where one players concentration already has been interrupted, because the other player is not acting as he should! It's not the director who should step in and interrupt two players getting along just fine - it's the player who's suffering that should be "allowed" to act (and find support in the rules) so that he can get a "fair game", where he don't have to be annoyed by his opponents antics or bad habits.
I fully support that idea, even if I agree with Chiva, that in a perfect world, this discussion is only academic!
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Chuck/Re rules not being too specific: If you go too far down that line you'll cause more incidents than you avoid by having some of these paragraphs being a little rubber-like. More disputes will happen, more people trying to take advantage of the rules. If you really have a situation where two players cannot come to terms with each other, about the effect of "vigorous", then call the director over, show him the shake and ask: Is this good enough? - and then get on with it. Instead of having a rule stating that dice should be shaken for at least 3 seconds, changing direction at least 4 times, with a speed fast enough for the dice to touch the fingers closing the cup. Being released at least one and a half inch over the board, with a speed causing them to hit the side of the bar before coming to rest. You see what kind of your word vs. my word could arise here, if one of the parameters is not met in one shake? Too many details would cause too many problems.
However I agree that a suitable penalty should be stated explicitly in all cases where the opponent can actually "benefit" from breaking the little rules, again and again. The early picking up of dice being a good example. You need to be able to penalize that, otherwise one player could give himself a benefit of just picking up early! And it's so much easier to hand over a penalty that are already outlined in the rules (eg. 30 seconds), than having to call over a director, who then must dictate something he comes up with himself as being reasonable, for the 4th time that same rule is broken....
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